Flag for Taxon: White-headed Lutung (Trachypithecus poliocephalus)

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Flag for Taxon: White-headed Lutung (Trachypithecus poliocephalus)

Flagger	Content Author	Content	Reason	Flag Created	Resolved by	Resolution
bouteloua		White-headed Lutung (Trachypithecus poliocephalus)	subspecies leucocephalus split off into a species in MDD	Mar. 29, 2019 03:30:12 +0000	loarie	see comments

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From @earthknight:

I noticed that the there is still some confusion on iNat concerning two sister species (one of which is the one I work with), and that the default image for the one I work with is actually an image of the sister species.
The species in question is the Cat Ba Langur (Trachypithecus poliocephalus), which is only found on Cat Ba Island in NE Vietnam, and the sister species is the White-headed Langur (Trachypithecus leucocephalus), which is only found in Southern China.

The complications arise here: https://www.inaturalist.org/taxa/75189-Trachypithecus-poliocephalus

That page should only refer to the Cat Ba Langur (Trachypithecus poliocephalus) and a different taxonomic page should be set up for the White Headed Langur (Trachypithecus leucocephalus) with the following address: https://www.inaturalist.org/taxa/75189-Trachypithecus-leucocephalus

The problem arises from the old categorization of the two being subspecies of T. poliocephalus, a convention which no-longer holds true.

The subspecies pages remain and mark the difference, but these should be elevated to from subspecies level to species level as they have been by the Mammal Diversity Database (see below).

Cat Ba Langur: https://www.inaturalist.org/taxa/147870-Trachypithecus-poliocephalus-poliocephalus

White-headed Langur: https://www.inaturalist.org/taxa/147871-Trachypithecus-poliocephalus-leucocephalus

Regardless of the the delay IUCN has made in posting updated information on many of the SE Asian primates, despite receiving updated species information over 4 years ago now, nearly all professionals in the field now refer to the two species as distinct (other than a few hold-outs). The Mammal Diversity Database has them separated as well (despite not having updated the images or the range maps).

Cat Ba Langur: https://mammaldiversity.org/species-account.php?genus=trachypithecus&species=poliocephalus

White-headed Langur: https://mammaldiversity.org/species-account.php?genus=trachypithecus&species=leucocephalus

Updating the iNat species pages would be a welcome change.

Thanks

Looks like there's an intentional deviation from MDD here:
https://www.inaturalist.org/taxa/75189/taxonomy_details

Can the reason for the deviation be explained, or the taxonomy updated? @loarie

Posted by bouteloua about 5 years ago

Our policy with mammals (so as not to loose the IUCN distribution maps) is to only resolve deviations from MDD once someone updates the species ranges.

As you say, MDD elevates the ssp to sp status while IUCN still considers them ssp. To resolve this deviation, please follow this tutorial to split the IUCN range map for Trachypithecus poliocephalus sensu lato into the two ssp ranges
https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/taxon-range-map-editing/146/3
then it will be trivial to elevate the spp to sp status

Posted by loarie about 5 years ago

cc: @bobby23 @jwidness are either of y'all interested in this task

Posted by bouteloua about 5 years ago

I can’t address this right now for health reasons. Sorry.

Posted by bobby23 about 5 years ago

oh no - hope you're doing ok bobby

Posted by loarie about 5 years ago

ack, sorry to hear :( my best wishes to you Bobby!

Posted by bouteloua about 5 years ago

I can do it early next week.

Fingers crossed for speedy recovery Bobby!

Posted by jwidness about 5 years ago

I made the new taxa and drafted the split. I don't have the power to commit the change or update the taxon framework relationships. Here's the draft: https://www.inaturalist.org/taxon_changes/55263.

Posted by jwidness about 5 years ago

Committed thanks jwidness! https://www.inaturalist.org/taxon_changes/55263
FYI @earthknight

Posted by loarie about 5 years ago

Thanks everyone. That's great.

The reliance on the IUCN range and data is sometimes frustrating as for many species the IUCN is incredibly slow to update their information.

Back in 2014 I submitted all the updated information for T. poliocephalus in response to a request for updated info for all of the SE Asian primates. None of the updated information for any of the species was ever posted and no-one at IUCN or on the SE Asian Primates Special Working Group appears able to explain what's going on. It's enough of a problem that it came up for discussion at the last IPS (International Primate Society) meeting in Nairobi.

Posted by earthknight about 5 years ago

Flag for Taxon: White-headed Lutung (Trachypithecus poliocephalus)

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